| Regstelsel in gedrang? [boodskap #100793 is 'n antwoord op boodskap #100801] |
Vr, 24 Desember 2004 14:37  |
Vusi
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Die volgende artikel van Max du Preez het op 23 Desember 2004 in die
"Pretoria News" in sy gereelde rubriek "Talk Today" verskyn.
(Dit blyk dat Max een van die weinige libbies/lefties wat sy waardes
konsekwent haandhaaf.)
Anti - jy kan moontlik 'n kopie aan Ferdietjiekie stuur - hy kan moontlik
die artikel gebruik as grondslag vir een van sy "rubrieke" in die Beeld....
Max du Preez in sy Rubriek "Talk Today"(Pretoria News 23 Desember 2004)
Judges should guard against losing citizens' trust
The reality that Zimbabwe was actually going down the drain dawned on me the
day the Zanu-PF government started interfering with the judicial system,
ignoring judgments coming from that country's upper courts and intimidating
and sacking judges.
A country can still live with a flawed democracy, even an authoritarian
government or corrupt bureaucracy, as long as the citizens can trust the
courts.
Even during the apartheid era with the draconian and racist laws of the time
a few brave and honest judges brought much hope and justice.
But once citizens believe that the judges and the judicial system cannot be
trusted, they know that when the day comes that their rights are threatened
they have nowhere to go. Then they lose faith in the entire system.
Despair leads to instability.
What I am trying to say is that the credibility and credentials of the
judiciary have to be absolutely impeccable, completely beyond reproach, if
that critical public belief in the system is to be maintained.
I have much personal experience of apartheid-era judges. With few exceptions
they served the government rather than justice. Many of them should never
have been judges at all.
Since 1994 our judiciary has been substantially rehabilitated. Not only were
there no unjust laws to apply, but they also had a great compass to steer
by: our Constitution. We now have a Constitutional Court as the final
arbiter. The fact that the Bench started to reflect the make-up of the
population helped much to restore trust in the system.
And there has been no evidence that the democratic government interfered
with the judges and their decisions.
Our judiciary became one of the strongest pillars of our stability.
It is against this backdrop that the recent wild statements by judges and
unseemly public spats between some of them should be seen as cause for
concern.
My hair stood on end when a recently appointed judge declared publicly and
angrily that he was not going to allow "Roman Dutch law to be forced down
his throat". The man is a judge, so ignorance cannot be his excuse. But many
ordinary people immediately sympathised with him, because what relevance can
a system coming from the Romans and the Dutch have in South Africa in 2004?
Most people understood that he meant a "white" legal tradition was forced
upon him. And who was forcing it to down his throat? "The whites"?
I thought it was a reckless statement. If he really has a problem with Roman
Dutch law. which I doubt because it is hardly relevant in the day to day-
application of our law today, he should have explained to the public what
Roman Dutch law was and why and how it affected him in his decision-making
as a judge. I thought it was a little racial tantrum. And as a judge he
should be above that.
But the recent utterances and attitudes of the Cape Judge President are even
more disturbing. He accused colleagues and senior officers of the court of
racism, charges that appeared clearly spurious on closer scrutiny.
His behaviour during the case between the Minister of Health and the
Pharmaceutical Society was perceived as odd and controversial and many of
his peers questioned his judgments.
And when the Supreme Court of Appeal this week strongly criticised his
handling of the case and overturned his decisions, the Cape Judge President
told newspaper reporters: "To be frank. I couldn't care less." That amounts
to a rude two-finger gesture to a court senior to his. lie went on to
criticise the ruling by the judges of the Supreme Court of Appeal. That is
conduct unbecoming, to put it mildly.
As a citizen who might just one day appear in court again, I hope I will
never appear before this judge. My fear, however irrational, is that he
might be more concerned with being assertive as a black man and with his own
ego than serving justice. I have appeared before several judges and
magistrates before in my life and they did not serve justice. Do not take my
word for it, go to the records. Forgive me for being nervous.
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| Re: Regstelsel in gedrang? [boodskap #100798 is 'n antwoord op boodskap #100793] |
Vr, 24 Desember 2004 12:14  |
bouer
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"Jonas" sskryf
> Max du Preez in sy Rubriek "Talk Today"(Pretoria News 23 Desember 2004)
> I have much personal experience of apartheid-era judges. With few exceptions
> they served the government rather than justice. Many of them should never
> have been judges at all.
Sit dit in jou pyp en rook dit, Jonas. ( Dis nou
een anglisisme toegelaat vir die dag.)
Gloudina
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| Re: Regstelsel in gedrang? [boodskap #100799 is 'n antwoord op boodskap #100793] |
Vr, 24 Desember 2004 12:17 |
bouer
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"Jonas" skryf
> Max du Preez in sy Rubriek "Talk Today"(Pretoria News 23 Desember 2004)
> Since 1994 our judiciary has been substantially rehabilitated. Not only were
> there no unjust laws to apply, but they also had a great compass to steer
> by: our Constitution. We now have a Constitutional Court as the final
> arbiter. The fact that the Bench started to reflect the make-up of the
> population helped much to restore trust in the system.
>
> And there has been no evidence that the democratic government interfered
> with the judges and their decisions.
>
> Our judiciary became one of the strongest pillars of our stability.
En hoe's daai nou vir 'n opsomming van wat
na 1994 gebeur het, Jonas?
Tant Hessie van die Derde Republiek
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| Re: Regstelsel in gedrang? [boodskap #100800 is 'n antwoord op boodskap #100793] |
Vr, 24 Desember 2004 12:28 |
bouer
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"Jonas" skryf
> Max du Preez in sy Rubriek "Talk Today"(Pretoria News 23 Desember 2004)
> My hair stood on end when a recently appointed judge declared publicly and
> angrily that he was not going to allow "Roman Dutch law to be forced down
> his throat".
Die kwessie van die gebruik van Romeins-Hollandse reg
in Suid-Afrika is natuurlik iets waaroor mens moet wonder.
Dis 'n reg wat deur koloniste ingebring is onder 'n bevolking
vir wie dit 'n vreemde konsep was. Mens sou dus verwag
dat daar op 'n sekere stadium daaroor beraadslag sal
moet word.
Hier in Kanada het ons die situasie dat die provinsie van
Quebec hulle eie regstelsel het ( dié een wat deur Napoleon
in Frankryk ingevoer is aan die einde van die agtiende eeu.)
Wetstudente wat in beide Quebec en die res van Kanada
wil praktiseer, moet dus twee wetstelsels bestudeer. Die
res van Kanada is onder die Common Law wat van
Engeland ingevoer is.
Dan word daar nou sterk aangedring deur Eerste Nasies
dat hulle die reg moet kry om op hulle eie lande hulle
eie aborginele wetstelsel moet kan toepas. Dit word dan
ook al op beperkte wyse toegelaat in sekere provinsies.
Daar is vir my 'n sterk verskil tussen die Britse Common
Law en die Romeins-Hollandse Reg. Veral wat kontrakte
betref. Kontrakte is baie meer heilig en bindend in
Romeins Hollandse Reg.
Gloudina
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| Re: Regstelsel in gedrang? [boodskap #100801 is 'n antwoord op boodskap #100794] |
Vr, 24 Desember 2004 06:09 |
Annette
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Jy dwaal.
--
Groetnis
Annette
"petrus" skryf in boodskap news:cqg6te$qdq$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> net jammer die anc hof (grondwetlike hof) se regters is almal anc lede en
> terroriste
>
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| Re: Regstelsel in gedrang? [boodskap #100803 is 'n antwoord op boodskap #100801] |
Vr, 24 Desember 2004 15:51 |
bouer
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"Jonas" skryf in boodskap news:cqh8is$ct1$1@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
> Anti.
> Het jy nooit enige vermoë ontwikkel om progressief te dink en te redeneer
> nie? Elke keer regverdig jy die apartheidstelsel deur dit gelyk te stel aan
> die heersende probleme en tekortkominge.
> Du Preez mis natuurlik die belangrikste punt mbt die ANC en hul inmenging in
> die regstelsel. Hulle is verantwoordelik vir aanstelling van regter Hlope
> wat die huidige probleem na 'n spits gebruik het. Hlope is, sou jy die media
> volg, volledig onbevoeg vir die posisie wat hy beklee.
> Gaan kyk ook maar gerus na die samestelling van die konstitusionele hof -
> die oorgrote meerderheid is voormalige ANC en SAKP lede. So - dis nie nodig
> om in te meng as jou perde reeds die wa trek nie.
> (Ek kan nie help om vir jou jammer te voel nie. Al die geld wat die
> apartheidsregering op jou opvoeding gespandeer het is vermors - nog 'n
> voorbeeld van die tekortkominge van daardie regime.)
>
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| Re: Regstelsel in gedrang? [boodskap #100804 is 'n antwoord op boodskap #100801] |
Vr, 24 Desember 2004 15:56 |
bouer
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"Jonas" skryf
> Gaan kyk ook maar gerus na die samestelling van die konstitusionele hof -
> die oorgrote meerderheid is voormalige ANC en SAKP lede. So - dis nie nodig
> om in te meng as jou perde reeds die wa trek nie.
Sover ek weet, is hulle eerwaardige en hoogs
gekultiveerde mense, wat ook die reg ken.
Ek is ook trots om te weet dat een van my
vorige studente op die konstitusionele hof
is.
Die howe van SA is tot 'n groot mate
op die model van Kanada geskool. Dit
is nie op die patroon van die Russe of
van die Duitsers onder Hitler nie. Daardie
beroemde westerse bevolking.
Gloudina
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| Re: Regstelsel in gedrang? [boodskap #100806 is 'n antwoord op boodskap #100800] |
Sa, 25 Desember 2004 00:20 |
Vusi
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Anti.
Het jy nooit enige vermoë ontwikkel om progressief te dink en te redeneer
nie? Elke keer regverdig jy die apartheidstelsel deur dit gelyk te stel aan
die heersende probleme en tekortkominge.
Du Preez mis natuurlik die belangrikste punt mbt die ANC en hul inmenging in
die regstelsel. Hulle is verantwoordelik vir aanstelling van regter Hlope
wat die huidige probleem na 'n spits gebruik het. Hlope is, sou jy die media
volg, volledig onbevoeg vir die posisie wat hy beklee.
Gaan kyk ook maar gerus na die samestelling van die konstitusionele hof -
die oorgrote meerderheid is voormalige ANC en SAKP lede. So - dis nie nodig
om in te meng as jou perde reeds die wa trek nie.
(Ek kan nie help om vir jou jammer te voel nie. Al die geld wat die
apartheidsregering op jou opvoeding gespandeer het is vermors - nog 'n
voorbeeld van die tekortkominge van daardie regime.)
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